¤ milky moon ¤

Posted: **27 Jun 2012, 19:14**

sounds good! I'll post thoughts in the other thread.

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 04:36**

I posted a set of hybrid lyrics on Unforumzed, using some of the originals that Ann posted and some of the changes I heard. Dan on our forum included some additional changes that I like, so I've highlighted those. Thanks, Dan. I'm still baffled by a couple parts.

A diver is my own love
And I am his, if I am to be deceived
Who takes one breath above for every hour below the sea

Who gave to me a jewel
Worth twice this woman's life
Though it cost her less
Than laying at low tide to see her true love phosphoresce

And in an infinite regress
Tell me why is the pain of birth
Lighter borne than the pain of death?
I ain't saying that I loved you first
But I loved you best

I know we must abide
Each by the rules that bind us here
The divers and the sailors and the women on the pier

How do you choose your form?
How do you choose your name?
How do you choose your life?
How do you choose the time you must exhale and kick and rise?

And in an infinite capsize
Like a boat tearing down the coast
Double hulls bearing double masts
I don't know if you loved me most
But you loved me last

Recall the word you gave
To count your way across the depths of this arid world
Well, you will yoke the waves that lay a bed of shining pearls

I dream it every night
The ringing of the ______
The motes of sand dislodge the shocking, _____ bright
That ______ cast-off shells reveal a single heart of white

And in an infinite backslide
Ancient boulders sink past the west
Like a sword at the bearer's fall
I can't claim that I knew you best
But did you know me at all?

A woman is a lie, a woman is a lie
You do not take her for a siren
In anchor on the stone alone, unfaceted and fine

And never will I wail
I'll hunt the pearl of death
To the bottom of my life
And ever hold my breath 'til I may be the diver's wife

See how the infinite divides
And the divers are not to blame
For the rift spanning distant shores
You don't know my name
But I know yours

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 04:52**

Ryan wrote:I posted a set of hybrid lyrics on Unforumzed

Link?

I just posted my "preferred hybrid" at http://www.joannanewsomlyrics.com/album ... e_as_sung/

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 05:12**

andrewb wrote:
Ryan wrote:I posted a set of hybrid lyrics on Unforumzed

Link?

I just posted my "preferred hybrid" at http://www.joannanewsomlyrics.com/album ... e_as_sung/

http://www.unforumzed.com/showthread.ph ... ew-song%29

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 07:24**

Hi all, Great work. One possible difference I heard in the lyrics was "and never will I wed" before "I'll hunt the pearl of death."

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 08:34**

andrewb that is definitely the best I've seen so far, thanks so much for compiling it. every verse is spot-on imo, there're only a couple of problems I can see:

I dream it every night:
the ringing of the praying, the motes of sand dislodged, the shucking, quick and bright:
the twinned and cast off shells reveal a single heart of white.

it's hard to hear praying at all. I think it's probably "the ringing of the pail", as in, a pail one would fill with shells at the seaside. a pail would ring if it was full of clanging shells (it'd have to be a metal pail, though). Another nitpick is that it's really impossible to hear a d after dislodge, and I think the verse is probably improved generally if we change it to dislodge - it keeps everything moving and present-tense.

I really like the way that verse is turning out, and the way you've punctuated it. It feels surreal and dreamlike and stream-of-consciousness, and shucking fits so perfectly - if there's a shucking, it suddenly makes much more sense that the twinned shells are cast off.

the depths of the severed world

I don't even know where to begin with this, lol. I know Ryan suggested "this arid world", which does sort of sound right, but contextually makes no sense... I mean, the world we're presented with just clearly isn't arid, and I don't know what the "depths of this arid world" would even be referring to. Hell? I dunno. I also don't hear world at all, I really do hear whirl, haha. Perhaps it's another Tulgeywood kind of word?

And how do you choose your thoughts?

form, not thoughts, it seems.

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 13:18**

Ryan wrote:A woman is a lie, a woman is a lie
You do not take her for a siren
In anchor on the stone alone, unfaceted and fine

"siren" actually makes a lot of sense there

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 16:52**

the depths of the severed world

I don't even know where to begin with this, lol. I know Ryan suggested "this arid world", which does sort of sound right, but contextually makes no sense... I mean, the world we're presented with just clearly isn't arid, and I don't know what the "depths of this arid world" would even be referring to. Hell? I dunno. I also don't hear world at all, I really do hear whirl, haha. Perhaps it's another Tulgeywood kind of word?

I posted this in the other thread about the song, but I think "arid" works because she is singing about the tide coming in over the sand. "Arid" means dry or waterless. In effect, the water is being pulled from the sea, over the dry land (that was exposed when the tide went out). Does that make sense?

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 18:33**

I dunno, I feel like pairing that with "depths" seems strange because depths seems to fit with water. Depths of the ocean. I don't know that depths would be paired with the dry sand and an arid world. I also feel like severed works because it seems like a similar image/idea to that last stanza: "the rift spanning distant shores." Severed, rifts. But I don't know, I think that one may remain a mystery until she plays the song again or maybe until the song is actually released. It's tough to hear, and all suggested lines are somewhat awkward.

More thoughts:

Where you will yoke the waves that lay a bed of shining pearls. [Are we in agreement this is yoke? I think this line is completely accurate.]
I dream it every night,
the ringing, oh the pale. [I wish this was just the ringing of the bell, how easy that would be and it fits in Joanna's writing well, but I really don't hear anything even close to bell (I can't hear prayer either, sorry!). I do think it's probably ringing though.]
The motes of sand, dislodged,
the shucking, quick and bright, the twinned and cast-off shells reveal a single heart of white. [I'm feeling pretty good about this part too, it all sounds right and makes sense.]

A woman is a lie, a woman is a lie [Does anyone have any commentary on this? We seem to think it's either a lie, alive or a light. It sounds most like a lie, but the way it's sung, I expect any consonants at the end could easily fade out and be missed. It's interesting to me in relation to the following lines, which we are also unsure of. For instance, if the line below is about not taking her for a siren, does it make sense to say a woman is a lie before that?]
you cannot take her for a siren, [I think siren is a good guess here because of the following lines, but she sings it so fast that I hear 'sign' more than anything else, just don't think it makes much sense.]
an anchor on a stone
alone, unfaceted and fine. [Can something be unfaceted and fine? I'm sort of feeling like those are conflicting.]
And never will I wed. [I definitely think this is right-- I've been adding to my own as new ideas come up, so sorry that I don't remember who suggested this, but great job.]
I'll hunt the pearl of death
to the bottom of my life.
And ever hold my breath till I may be the diver's wife.

I'm excited how much we have completed of this, and how well it seems to fit. Some HOOM songs had huge areas of gibberish that we never got.

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 19:39**

Ann wrote:A woman is a lie, a woman is a lie [Does anyone have any commentary on this? We seem to think it's either a lie, alive or a light. It sounds most like a lie, but the way it's sung, I expect any consonants at the end could easily fade out and be missed. It's interesting to me in relation to the following lines, which we are also unsure of. For instance, if the line below is about not taking her for a siren, does it make sense to say a woman is a lie before that?]
you cannot take her for a siren, [I think siren is a good guess here because of the following lines, but she sings it so fast that I hear 'sign' more than anything else, just don't think it makes much sense.]
an anchor on a stone
alone, unfaceted and fine. [Can something be unfaceted and fine? I'm sort of feeling like those are conflicting.]
And never will I wed. [I definitely think this is right-- I've been adding to my own as new ideas come up, so sorry that I don't remember who suggested this, but great job.]
I'll hunt the pearl of death
to the bottom of my life.
And ever hold my breath till I may be the diver's wife.

When I first heard this I heard:

A woman is alive, a woman is alive

drawn out like- :aaaaaaAAlive:

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 21:45**

Andrew wrote:andrewb that is definitely the best I've seen so far, thanks so much for compiling it. every verse is spot-on imo, there're only a couple of problems I can see:

I dream it every night:
the ringing of the praying, the motes of sand dislodged, the shucking, quick and bright:
the twinned and cast off shells reveal a single heart of white.

it's hard to hear praying at all. I think it's probably "the ringing of the pail", as in, a pail one would fill with shells at the seaside. a pail would ring if it was full of clanging shells (it'd have to be a metal pail, though). Another nitpick is that it's really impossible to hear a d after dislodge, and I think the verse is probably improved generally if we change it to dislodge - it keeps everything moving and present-tense.

I really like the way that verse is turning out, and the way you've punctuated it. It feels surreal and dreamlike and stream-of-consciousness, and shucking fits so perfectly - if there's a shucking, it suddenly makes much more sense that the twinned shells are cast off.

"Pail" makes a lot more sense than "praying", but in Wanbli's recording I just can't hear "pail". There's an R in there. Is that the same recording you're referring to?

I think "the x dislodge" would be a strange construction. Grammatically, "dislodged" makes the phrase match "the ringing of the x", while "dislodge" makes it match "reveal a x".

the depths of the severed world

I don't even know where to begin with this, lol. I know Ryan suggested "this arid world", which does sort of sound right, but contextually makes no sense... I mean, the world we're presented with just clearly isn't arid, and I don't know what the "depths of this arid world" would even be referring to. Hell? I dunno. I also don't hear world at all, I really do hear whirl, haha. Perhaps it's another Tulgeywood kind of word?

And how do you choose your thoughts?

form, not thoughts, it seems.

Yes, I changed it to "this arid" thanks to Ryan and milklake.

And I agree about "form" — will change that too.

Ann wrote:A woman is a lie, a woman is a lie [Does anyone have any commentary on this? We seem to think it's either a lie, alive or a light. It sounds most like a lie, but the way it's sung, I expect any consonants at the end could easily fade out and be missed. It's interesting to me in relation to the following lines, which we are also unsure of. For instance, if the line below is about not taking her for a siren, does it make sense to say a woman is a lie before that?]

Yeah, I'm going with "light". It just makes more sense. To get mathematical: he probability that "light" would sound like "like", multiplied by the probability that she would sing "light", is higher than the probability that she would sing "lie".

alone, unfaceted and fine. [Can something be unfaceted and fine? I'm sort of feeling like those are conflicting.]
And never will I wed. [I definitely think this is right-- I've been adding to my own as new ideas come up, so sorry that I don't remember who suggested this, but great job.]
I'll hunt the pearl of death
to the bottom of my life.
And ever hold my breath till I may be the diver's wife.

I'm excited how much we have completed of this, and how well it seems to fit. Some HOOM songs had huge areas of gibberish that we never got.

You're right. I'm going with "alone and faceted and fine", which is what I heard originally.

And yeah, I think we've done a good job.

Seem to be hitting the point of diminishing returns though. Need more material!

Posted: **28 Jun 2012, 22:09**

andrewb wrote:
"Pail" makes a lot more sense than "praying", but in Wanbli's recording I just can't hear "pail". There's an R in there. Is that the same recording you're referring to?

Interesting -- I'm going off Wanbli's recording, but I listened to the other one (the video) today and in neither can I hear prayer. I seem to be distinctly hearing an l, not an r. Interesting little distinction that we hear completely different sounds haha.

I always try to keep conscious that Joanna has some wonky pronunciations going on sometimes. Or even just playing a song live, a little trip of the tongue can make something sound different than it is. How nice it'd be to have another performance of this for comparison (and simply to have another performance!)

Posted: **29 Jun 2012, 01:19**

NobodyfromNowhere wrote:
NobodyfromNowhere wrote:You all seem to be doing a great job deciphering the lyrics here. A couple of possible variations to what is being posted:

2nd line, 1st stanza: And I am his, if I am to meet the Sea (rather than "to be deceived"--- seems to flow better and make more sense in context)

1st line, 11th stanza: And never will I wade (rather than "wed" --- same reason as above; also it reinforces the image of the rest of the stanza... i.e. she does not want to stay along the shore wading, knee-deep, trudgin along anymore... she means to take the plunge and go diving on the deep end)

Keep up the good work everyone!

Oops. I just realized that she probably is not rhyming "sea" with "sea," although that is actually what I heard for the first line. I think she probably is saying "if I am to be deceived" even though I am not sure what she means by that. Maybe it is that the narrator considers the diver to be her true love while not really believing that he cherishes her in the same way. Maybe she has had some bad experiences of betrayal? Maybe she was expecting him to produce more pearls than he could find and now she doubts his skills? Maybe they had agreed upon a time to rendezvous and he didn't show...perhaps laid up under a rock somewhere with a bad case of the bends? ...

But I still think that the other line is "and never will I wade"

Well, yeah, I sorta equated the "if I am to be deceived" with the all the lines about loving him but that love not really being returned. So I took it as a theme that he certainly didn't love her back. At first, I thought it was strange that she said she is his love in relation to the rest of the song -- that's when I got the "deceived" part.

Posted: **29 Jun 2012, 03:34**

i dunno i think wear fits the line a lot better than wade.

@pail vs praying - do you really hear an r? I'm honestly trying to hear it and I can't at all. I am listening to wanbli's recording and there are several others around, they all sound basically the same lol. Pail also undeniably works in context better than prayer...

Posted: **29 Jun 2012, 09:24**

Thank you all, for doing such a good job trying to pin down the lyrics of this beautiful new song! Might I suggest "pang of birth"?

Posted: **29 Jun 2012, 09:50**

I hear it as 'I dream in every night the ringing of the prayer'. And then I think it's, "A woman is alive, a woman is alive, you do not take her from his side."

I also used to think it was 'the depths of the southern world' rather than 'arid world' but now I'm not too sure. And 'the divers and the seers' rather than 'the divers and the sailors'.

Posted: **29 Jun 2012, 10:46**

"Arid" makes perfect sense to me. I think "this arid world" is her world and that he promised her to do his best to find his way there with her, but he is out of his depth there, having to "count" his movements, while in the sea he is at home, he can make his way there by experience and intuition, so it will always draw him back.
I think the second line begins with "To" and not "And". Perhaps "Tonight"?

Posted: **29 Jun 2012, 18:50**

stunning-sky wrote:I hear it as 'I dream in every night the ringing of the prayer'. And then I think it's, "A woman is alive, a woman is alive, you do not take her from his side."

I also used to think it was 'the depths of the southern world' rather than 'arid world' but now I'm not too sure. And 'the divers and the seers' rather than 'the divers and the sailors'.

Yeah, seers and sailors sound remarkably alike if you don't take too much effort enunciating the l. Sailors fits the ocean imagery, but it's not as if seers is out of place in the song. (I get so invested in guessing lyrics I'm practically more excited to get official lyrics than an official recording

)

Posted: **30 Jun 2012, 19:05**

NobodyfromNowhere wrote:I think the narrator is not certain of anything. Probably the diver loves her very much. Maybe he was acting aloof after he saw her roaming the shores with another man. Maybe he thinks that she certainly does not love him.

From the first chorus-y part of "I ain't saying that I loved you best," following through to the last, I feel that there's a tale of unmatched affection until it's almost entirely one-sided (assuming the same person/thing is being addressed). "I don't know if you loved me most," "Did you know me at all?" "You don't know my name." I've interpreted it as a mostly one-sided relationship (a la Easy?), but there is a relationship of some sort -- "you loved me last." To me, all of this fits with an intro of, "A diver is my own love, and I am his -- if I am to be deceived." The song is from the narrator's perspective, so that's all I can infer from. But I don't know, the line could definitely be wrong, we're all humbly guessing here. I do think it fits in with the rest of the song pretty well, though.

Posted: **01 Jul 2012, 15:17**

I love it!!

¤ milky moon ¤

Divers ['The Diver's Wife']

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